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got a pair today there was no ret pallies with us so i took it for tanking. it has nice stats for both tanking and ret.
Saying that these are not designed for tanking can only mean you don't play a prot pally tank...the stats on these are much more welcomed to a protadin then that of the "tanking" verson of these legs...I'm definitely going to opt for these when I get the chance.
According to EJ, these should be gemmed with 2 x bold rubies, what do you think?
These legs are clearly better for tanking than the prot version. You can reforge the hit into dodge/parry and you will probably even end up with the socket bonus if you use mastery/stam gems. Yay haste! (jk)
In fact there are no other epic plate legs with mastery on at the moment, so these aren't just the best choice, they are the only choice. Nothing better is going to drop for you until a content patch comes along.
The only thing I'd worry about is that blizz has occasionally gone back and changed things when they see people buying things they aren't "supposed" to buy. It would be annoying to spend 2200 points on these, only to have blizz change the mastery to crit, for example. Not saying they will do this, but I'd probably spend points on other items first - certainly the chest and gloves if not other stuff as well, before buying these.
The only legplates that can equal these in mastery (or surpass depending on gemming) on normal difficulty are the
Наголенники грозовой стены
"of the Bedrock" or "of the Rockslab" from Al'Akir. Those 2 enchants give 208 mastery.
They are NOT better than the prot legs for tanking
There was a question about the tank legs vs the dps legs on the official WoW forums and i thought id bring my math from there to here so that other players can see that the tanking legs are better. I ended up calculating this for both warriors and paladins >.>
For people checking my math we get the equivalent of 58 dodge rating for every 100 agility. Dodge from base agility does not diminish so it is not included.
Okay lets look at this mathematically and using your current gemming strat:
Lets look at the two legs
Tank Legs-current legs
-74 dodge would give you 8.1717% dodge over the current 8.5055 dodge you get from dodge rating/agility
133 parry would give you 10.1902% parry over the current 9.6227% parry.
2mastery or 0.0251% block or 0.0100% damage reduction
Total damage reduction would be 0.2437%+58stamina (934hp) over your current gear
The dps legs -current legs:
-187 dodge rating or 7.6546% dodge
215 masterry or 2.6983block which is 1.0793% damage reduction
Total damage reduction is: 0.2284% damage reduction and lose 2 stamina (32hp) over your current gear.
The tank legs are better
If you get these in BH and there are no ret paladins then power to you. But the tanking legs are better. Mastery is our best stat (for now) but a large chunk of mastery is NOT better than two large chunks of advoidance.
Umm, no. The only reason your comparison shows such a big stamina difference is b/c you're gemming for the +20 haste socket bonus on the dps legs (which is absurd for a protadin). If you use the same (or equivalent) gems for both dps and prot T11 legs, there is only a 30 stamina gain from using the prot legs (from the socket bonus). The dps legs have enough extra CTC (once you reforge hit rating to dodge or parry) to overcome that difference in stamina. Furthermore, your item comparison shouldn't include
; it should be a straight comparison between the prot and dps T11 legs. The leggings you're upgrading *from* shouldn't affect your decision on which leggings to upgrade *to*. Here's a better
, using equivalent gems in both legs.
To put it another way, mastery *is* that much better than dodge and parry. A poster at Elitist Jerks said it better than I ever could:
"It may not be obvious to all that even if you take more dmg overall, if the incoming dmg curve is smoother and more predictable you actually cost less mana to keep alive. Predictable curve translate to less spikes / less reactive healing and that translates to;
- Improved mana efficiency by using slower but more HPM efficient spells.
- Reduced need to be toped off at all times, thus lowering over-healing and letting HoTs tick for actual healing. Again, being more efficient on mana.
So even if your DTPS (dmg taken per second) is higher than the next tank, you can be easier to heal and more efficient on your healers mana".
Edited for clarification.
The example i gave was of a tank who values both mastery and stamina equally. Thus thats how you would gem even if you ignore the socket bonus altogether under this assumption. Going by that example the gemming in your example is less than idea as you ignore what is for all intents and purposes a free socket bonus (even as crappy of a stat as haste may be).
Furthermore, if you took an example of a tank who feels mastery is better than stam (but still feels stam bonuses are worth getting) you would STILL get the socket bonus as mastery is a yellow stat. Changing this from a mastery=stam to a mastery>stam philosophy would not change the results. The prot legs give more stamina and more hp.
Speaking of which, since you use a mastery>stam philosophy why did you go out of your way to ignore the bonus? Its free stats for mastery stackers. Its like you are spiting yourself just cause you dont like the bonus. Free stats are free.
Also the old legs do indeed matter as you both LOSE stats and gain new ones. This is particularly important if you want to get the avoidance figures right seeing as avoidance is affected by Diminishing returns.
As for smoothing out the damage curve, avoidance also accomplishes this. As your avoidance goes up so does the mean time between damage spikes. High avoidance gives the healer more time between back to back hits to breath. Low avoidance makes it seem like the healer cant look away from you for a moment.
The actual benefit of favoring mastery over avoidance is it reduces the worst case scenario of two back to back unblocked hits more which can lead to a tank death in a hardmode encounter....of course if we were talking about hardmodes you would either want the 4p for the bonus (with the daybreaker helm as the offset piece) or you would be using the Al'Akir legs over either of these.
In normal mode t11 (if its still progression at this point) the concern tends to be mana conservation in which overall DR trumps slightly more CTC. Not to mention that the Prot legs give more Time to live than the ret legs even using pure mastery gems and mastery hybrids.
And the fact that now in 4.2, you cant just stack avoidance, because of the improvement of itemization, made dps much stronger, thus reducing your threat. Now You need to be hit/expertised capped so that u can keep with their aggro. At that point its not avoidance that will reduce ur incoming damage, but the lack of threat
Actually you could. Vengeance was that Overpowered. This was made even more moot as they now buffed threat from 3 threat per damage to 5 threat per damage making threat even LESS IMPORTANT.
BTW: threat never reduced damage taken.
Attention angry nerds:
If you are a tank, you could probably take either these OR the "actual" tank choice. The thread linked above (
) runs you through the specifics, but the difference is negligible. It will not make or break your tanking. Personally I took the tank option because I feel like it's a waste to skip the set bonus, however lackluster it may be.
Do what makes you happy.
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